Matsubara blades, from Matsubara, Omura City, Nagasaki, have their origins in a blacksmithing tradition that came to the town with refugees from the Battle of Dannoura, over 800 years ago. Those techniques are still being used today the production of knives and farm tools. We visited Tanaka Kama Kogyo to find out more about their line of kitchen knives they simply call “Knives for Men.”
Interview by Takafumi Suzuki
Translation by Claire Tanaka
Mr. Tanaka, were you born here?
Yes, that’s right. I’m a local. I was born and raised here.
How many generations have there been at your company?
I’m the fourth generation. They say my family used to be farmers who also made sickles and other farm tools.
Matsubara has a long history as a blacksmith’s town, doesn’t it?
Yes. About five hundred years ago, blacksmiths came along when the defeated Heike warriors escaped to Hyuga (present day Miyazaki prefecture) and wound up settling here in Matsubara. They say that was the start of the history of Matsubara blades. The local industry reached its peak in the period before World War II, when there were about twenty-one workshops here. When I started, it was so busy that people would come in and say, “What’s this, you’re supposed to be a blacksmith but you haven’t got any blades?” I was just that busy. The neighborhood elementary school, Matsubara Elementary has a line in their school song about “The echo of the pounded earth” which references the sound of the blacksmith’s hammer. That just goes to show how this town really used to echo with the sound of blacksmiths at work.
“The blade that originated with the swordmaker” – what’s that all about?
That’s not just Matsubara blade technology. Almost all forged blades made in Japan are made that way. The tip of the blade is surrounded in soft metal. If the tip is just made of steel, it’s too hard. It’ll easily snap off. It’s wrapped in softer metal so that the strength of the blade is increased.
You call your knives “Knives for Men.” That’s a rather unique name. How did you come to call them that?
It’s really hard to make a knife that is a new product. Actually, there are only two different types of knife: debabocho (kitchen cleaver for fish) and nakiri bocho (knife for vegetables). Just two types. They’re all the same basic shape. So I met a lot of people who talked to me about what they thought I should do, and they said “Why not develop a new kind of knife?” and “If you make this part shaped like this, it’ll look stylish” and things like that. The people I spoke to were from other industries, they weren’t knife makers. But those people are the ones who have the freest ideas.
So everyone’s words became a starting point for you, then.
That’s right. I decided to try and use everyone’s knowledge and my own techniques to make something. That’s why it might cost a bit more, but this knife uses a lot of genuine swordsmith’s techniques and they’re made with great care.
Why the emphasis on “men?”
I remember from when I was a child, seeing men of all ages sharpening knives. Each house had a sharpening stone and people would go to the local well and sharpen their knives there. I wanted men to think back to those days as they use my knives. That was my idea.
You cut and clean fish yourself, don’t you?
Yes. If I didn’t, then how would I know if my knives were any good? I asked my mother, who has worked in an inn for years and knows her way around a kitchen quite well, how to cut fish. Farm implements too, sickles and hoes, I try them all out as well.
You got your mother to teach you how to cook! What a lovely family.
I really hate how the old way that families used to relate is dying out these days. That’s why I don’t hesitate to ask my mother to teach me things, and really one reason for my “Man’s Knives” are because I want fathers to lead by example, to show their children that they are comfortable in the kitchen. That’s why I do this. And that’s why I want to make a blade that can cut well.
Do you have any opinions about where the modern Japanese family is going these days?
Everyone is so busy these days, and there isn’t much conversation between family members, don’t you think? The family as a group is slipping away. My family is the same. My kids have after-school classes, and we only have dinner all together about once a week. Those are the times we live in. There’s nothing to be done about it. But we’ve got to value that one day we have per week, and if Dad can show off his talents in the kitchen on that day, that’s pretty good, isn’t it? I can’t cook very well, but I really enjoy cutting up fish with a sharp knife. I’d like my children to have that image of myself as their father.
Were you personally influenced by watching your father at work?
Yes. My father got sick and had to retire, but when I first made these knives, I showed them to him and he gave me some advice on how I could make them.
It must be hard for you at work with your father retired?
Yes it is. I was hoping to have him help me out until he was at least in his eighties. (laughs) My father was mostly in charge of hoes and other farm tools. Now it’s so hard to train people. They say it takes a craftsman ten years to learn his craft, but it’s not that simple. (bitter laugh)
What part is difficult for you?
First of all, you’ve got to know about everything: materials, the qualities of fire, about knives and hoes themselves. And then there are things you can only learn from experience. If you say, “Make it longer” then you can’t just stretch the metal out. This part has to be thick, and this part thinner, if you don’t make it perfectly straight then it’ll get distorted later. Things like that.
I see.
Myself, I’ve been watching the work going on in the family workshop since I was in elementary school. I used to love coming home from school and staring into the welding fire. But I’d get all excited when sparks would fly, or I’d burn my eyes from staring too long, and night would come and it would be time to go to bed and I wouldn’t be able to close my eyes all the way. (laughs) I think I learned a lot just from the air.
A lot of craftspeople talk about “learning from the air.” Could you tell me a little more specifically what you mean by that?
Cutting and shaving the metal, hammering it, getting a sense for that kind of thing. You don’t just raise the hammer and bring it down. It’s not that simple. There’s a rhythm, a certain sound. It’s a bit like hitting a golfball, in a way. (laughs) Even with the same hammer, when my father does it, he can shape the metal so well. But when I was a kid, I’d try to do it the same way and it wouldn’t budge. Plus, it’s a one kilo hammer so you stop being able to lift it up pretty quick. (laughs) But my father’s face never changed, and he could whip things up one after another in quick succession. I’d start to wonder, “how does he do that?” and learn his techniques by watching what he did.
What are your plans for the future?
It’s different now than it was in the old days, with modern kitchens, and different ingredients too. There are a lot of fruits on the market that we didn’t have before, and people are cooking with meat more as well. A lot of people these days don’t know how to sharpen or care for a knife. I’m thinking I’ve got to develop a knife that can meet those conditions. (laughs)
Tanaka Kama Kogyo
Matsubarahoncho 371, Omura city, Nagasaki
Katsuto Tanaka
Born in Matsubara in 1962. Fourth president of Tanaka Kama Kogyo, Blacksmith
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PingMag MAKE is the sister site to PingMag. We use an interview format to put the spotlight on a wide range of people active in rural areas. We document the voices of these unknown heroes and broadcast them to the world. It’s the Japan-based magazine about people and making things, coming out once a week. We’re passing on the passion, ideas, skills, and life stories of people who are building today and exploring tomorrow: craftsmen, engineers, entrepreneurs, and inventors. Stay tuned!
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An extremely great article. I read it from top to bottom. Keep the good work!!!!
Posted by: Álvaro on September 3rd, 2008 at 1:50 am
Mr. Tanaka’s “Knives For Men” are made with techniques used 800 years ago which is fascinating to me.
The tip of nearly every knife I have ever used in the kitchen has broken off. When I buy one of their knives, I know that I will have an entact knife tip.How nice!
Thank you for sharing this wonderful interview on knife making in a Japanese work shop.
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